Tips on a new kayak

[Neumie]

Do you guys have any thoughts on the perception prism 14?

Classic, OG fishing kayak from the 90's. One of the nicest paddling yaks ever designed. As far as one for standing and fishing from? I'd probably keep on looking. There's really not a good flat spot to stand on.

[Ron Mc]

Do you guys have any thoughts on the perception prism 14?

here's a recent very good thread on the Prism and similar fast boats.
http://www.texaskayakfisherman.com/foru ... &p=2284329

With your frame, you'd have no problem standing in a Heritage Redfish 12 or 14, which has plenty of flat, good wind performance, and still pretty fast.

[backwaterscruise120]

Thanks for that specs page on the prism nuemie.
I started looking at the heritage redfish kayaks and found 3 or 4 different 12’ ones that look like they were garage kept. All of them are asking about 550? Does that seem like a good price?

The other two that i was really interested in are the native manta Ray 12xt and the tarpon 120 or 140. Which do you think would be easier to stand from? the 120 or 140?

I called a local shop and asked them about what models they thought would have minimal Hull slap and suit my needs and they listed the Jackson liska, bite, old town predator mx and bonafide rs127. Do any of these stand out to you?

[Neumie]

Thanks for that specs page on the prism nuemie.
I started looking at the heritage redfish kayaks and found 3 or 4 different 12’ ones that look like they were garage kept. All of them are asking about 550? Does that seem like a good price?

The other two that i was really interested in are the native manta Ray 12xt and the tarpon 120 or 140. Which do you think would be easier to stand from? the 120 or 140?

I called a local shop and asked them about what models they thought would have minimal Hull slap and suit my needs and they listed the Jackson liska, bite, old town predator mx and bonafide rs127. Do any of these stand out to you?

The Redfish 12 are pretty quiet on the water, if memory serves me correctly. Wait, which model run of the Redfish 12? Can you post links? They've changed hulls recently.

The Manta Ray 12 XT, looks like a good choice, but it's a relatively new kayak on the market and I haven't paddled it. The Tarpons are quiet on the on the water.

I haven't paddled the Liska, but have paddled the Mayfly and Coosa HD and found they had bad hull slap, so I would not recommend those kayaks. Plus, those are geared more for rivers and are poor tracking. I haven't padded the RS117, but I have paddled the SS127. When I paddled it there was noise coming from I think the the removable fishfinder unit and not necessarily the hull. The problem with the Predator MX and RS117 is the kayak deck overhangs the entry" V". So at certain angles in a slightly choppy water you could have spots where the water could get "trapped" or act like a spray rail.

IMO, you want to avoid designs where the front deck of the kayak is wider and over hangs the entry "V" of the hull (Predator MX). Kayaks which get too wide too quickly for stability tend to plow throw waves and not slice through them (Liska, Mayfly). Also, kayaks with lots of lots of angles and hard chines above the waterline which could trap water and cause hull slaps.

Having said all this, not kayak is perfectly quiet on the water. Even my Search 15 will get some slap under certain conditions. If targeting redfish on the flats a little hull slap isn't going to make or break your day/trip. Making unnecessary noise, such as banging you paddle on the side of the kayak, will spook fish more than a little hull slap.

Test paddling is going to be your best option for figuring out if a kayak will suit your needs. Even with all my opinions of which kayaks I feel are quiet I still need to reiterate that I weigh 50 lbs more than you. That's enough to slightly change a kayak's paddling characteristics for better or worse. A kayak I paddle may be really quiet on the water, but could have quite a bit of hull slap with a lighter framed paddler like yourself.

[ben_beyer]

My $0.02.

I have a Coosa HD and the tracking seems as good as my dad's Ocean Kayak Trident Prowler that had a rudder but that is an older design. I tried some other kayaks in the past that were rentals and the Coosa HD seemed on par but Neumie also has more experience with better kayaks for the type of fishing you are asking about.

I went with the Coosa HD because I mostly fish for bass and to me that's where it excels. I haven't been on a river with it yet as I had to cancel my Colorado River trip this spring due to work. It can work on shallow saltwater but I wouIdn't take it out if the winds are getting above 15 knots.

[Neumie]

My $0.02.

I have a Coosa HD and the tracking seems as good as my dad's Ocean Kayak Trident Prowler that had a rudder but that is an older design. I tried some other kayaks in the past that were rentals and the Coosa HD seemed on par but Neumie also has more experience with better kayaks for the type of fishing you are asking about.

I went with the Coosa HD because I mostly fish for bass and to me that's where it excels. I haven't been on a river with it yet as I had to cancel my Colorado River trip this spring due to work. It can work on shallow saltwater but I wouIdn't take it out if the winds are getting above 15 knots.

I may be confusing it with the Coosa; it's been a few years and was a quick paddle on the river. You're more in tune with the kayak and will be better at giving its characteristics better than I.

[backwaterscruise120]

Alright that makes sense.
I should have phrased it better. I understand that every kayak will have hull slap. I'm just trying to narrow down my selection to the ones designed to be quieter overall. The characteristics you are talking about in hull design make more sense to me(not having an overhang on the front deck). That way I can apply it to all kayaks instead of just asking about a certain model. I have some research to do.

https://spacecoast.craigslist.org/boa/d ... 92369.html

the listings i was talking about are not showing up anymore but here is one of the same design. This one seems to be cheaper because it has a bad hole that was patched in the back. I want to stay away from that. Is around 500 for a good condition redfish 12 similar design to this?

Overall you're right. I'm doing a lot of talking when I just need to get out there and test them out.

The coosa seems like a really nice kayak. There is a guy who does a lot of sight fishing in the Louisiana marshes on youtube with his.

[SWFinatic]

Keep us posted on what you end up getting. There are so many new kayaks out or coming out. That will have an impact on the used market too.

[ben_beyer]

The coosa seems like a really nice kayak. There is a guy who does a lot of sight fishing in the Louisiana marshes on youtube with his.

I can stand in my Coosa HD no problem. A few big gusts this weekend had me a little wobbly though so take that in to account.

[ben_beyer]

I may be confusing it with the Coosa; it's been a few years and was a quick paddle on the river. You're more in tune with the kayak and will be better at giving its characteristics better than I.

No problem. It's different water than a lake or a river and the Coosa HD can work if it's not windy. Every kayak is a compromise in my opinion which makes it difficult to pick one to do everything. The other thing is you cannot put a rudder on it, which is important at times on the coast. I got by this weekend without it but there have been times where I needed a rudder.

[backwaterscruise120]

Well I ended up going with the heritage redfish angler 12. It was used of course because they no longer produce this model. I tried it out and loved it. It’s everything I’m looking for at the moment. I just wanted to say thanks to everyone for the help.
Now I just need to start rigging it.
It’s just the regular version so it doesn’t come with the rod Holders. I’m going to put a Scotty rod holder and possibly a fish finder up front between my feet. I think I want an anchor trolley on one side. I also want to put mounting tracks on each side on the area right in front of the seat.
Im trying to decide between a milk crate/rod holder for the back area or a fish bag.
What do you guys think?

[backwaterscruise120]

Sorry not the angler just the regular heritage redfish 12

[Ron Mc]

I think you picked a great boat.
We have a 10 that my daughter grew up in, and it's still a useful boat even for me and my friends.
Stable, fast, wind-slippery.
The 10 needed a skeg to make it coast-wind-worthy, but you won't have that problem with the 12.
(The windcock on 10' boats is all about sitting so far behind the center of the keel)



My buddy has 10 also.
A couple of rigging ideas are putting ram balls behind the seat and in front center of the cockpit



There's a real nice milk-crate footing designed into the sternwell, and you can build rod holders into your milk crate

the other thing we did was a dashboard bar - bought this bar from Harmony close-out, but Mad Frog Gear still makes this bar

[SWFinatic]

Congrats on your new to you kayak! I recommend taking in fishing a few times before you do anything to it. A rod holder in front between your legs can always be used tho. I know I've spent time and money buying things that I ended up not using.

A crate with rod holders in the rear tank well I think would come in handy. If you want to use a fish bag too an option is to strap one on the bow if the kayak using pad eyes. Keep in mind the amount of weight you add to the kayak. Less weight the better.

[backwaterscruise120]

Those are some awesome ideas Ron! I'm going to have to try and make something similar to that rack up front.

I agree with you SWfinatic. I'm definitely taking it out before doing most of these mods.
The main things I've found to be important to me on the paddleboard was ways to anchor off on each side of the boat. I haven't had an anchor trolley yet but I really liked the idea of being able to adjust the position according to current/wind etc...
Another important thing was some way to store my rod up front so I could change from the paddle to rod while standing effortlessly and quickly. I saw someone with a belt clip for a paddle that looked pretty cool.

I'm thinking the fishfinder will be really helpful for locating exactly where those deeper holes are. As of now I've just been trying to find them on google maps and hope they are still there. Do you think it would be better to go with a transducer that mounts of the side or on the bottom of the boat? I know there would be less drilling with the option of the side.

[Ron Mc]

would never suggest anyone jump into rigging without first evaluating what they want and need - the point being there are rigging options to cutting holes and drilling blind holes in boats.
As long as you drill where you can back with bonded sealing washers, you can make every mod leak-tight.
https://www.boltdepot.com/Bonded_sealin ... _18-8.aspx
Also drill your holes just slightly under-size so they self-tap, and tighten with the nylok on the backing.

taking advantage of the milk crate footing in the sternwell is a no-brainer.

This skeg mod used existing wellnuts in the transom, attached fairleads to bungee guides using external sex bolts, and only drilled two holes for a deployment line cleat - the only two holes ever drilled in this leak-tight boat.

I can share my bracket design if you ever want to hang a rudder
Some of the Heritage boats were delivered with wellnuts up high for a rudder gudgeon, others with the wellnuts low for a Tag-along wheel to roll the boat, and this was was the latter.
I designed the delrin bracket so you could accidentally drop the boat on the skeg without bending the bracket, which I've proved a couple of times by accident.
While this works for a ruddder also, a rudder bracket could be much simpler than this - a 3/4" by 1-1/2" delrin bar with countersunk holes at the top to back a Trucourse gudgeon plate.
https://www.duckworks.com/product-p/k748200-parent.htm
Duckworks is kind of the everything store for kayak rudder hardware

[ben_beyer]

Congratulations on getting a kayak.

The great thing about a kayak is you can upgrade/change a lot easier than a boat.

I have the Coosa HD and I plan to keep it. If I continue to make it to the coast 3 or 4 times a year, I may have to get another kayak and so I'm looking at getting a Tarpon 140 or 160 if I can find a good used one is 6 or 8 months.

I don't really need 2 kayaks but they're affordable so some people have 3 or 4 sometimes.

[backwaterscruise120]

How much did that rudder cost you in total? I checked and my kayak has the opposite bolt pattern of the one in your picture.

[Ron Mc]

that's not a rudder, it's just a skeg to lengthen the keel for downwind tracking.
Without it, the 10' boat always wants to nose-up into the wind - like luffing a sloop with just mainsail - and it's also a big coast wind thing.
The 12' boat doesn't have that problem, because you sit in the center of the keel.
Just stumbled on this article that talks about windcocking.
https://paddling.com/learn/going-straig ... r-or-skeg/

Your boat is rudder-ready. You can bolt a gudgeon plate straight to it.
It's a pretty good hull for a rudder, though the boat will spin nicely with hard paddle strokes.
It's really a good all-around boat, wind slippery and still good river handling and stability.

[creekstone]

The Tarpons are quiet on the on the water.

Does anyone have an opinion on the discontinued Tarpon 130x?

[Ron Mc]

Does anyone have an opinion on the discontinued Tarpon 130x?

two reviews posted - even the guy who likes said it was noisy, and he's never owned a different kayak
https://paddling.com/gear/wilderness-sy ... 30x-kayak/
None of the magazine reviews took issue with it, but all said it was slower than the Tarpons.

[creekstone]

Thanks for the link to that review. I was hoping someone on here had experience with the 130x.

My Tarpon 140 is fine. But I'd like to sit a tad higher. That was my reason for asking about the 130x. Maybe I'll try a seat pad. I seem to recall Dean, aka Slowride, using another seat on top of the OEM seat.

[TexasJim]

creekstone: I put a Gone Fishin' seat in my Pescador 12(old Tarpon 120), but the seat bottom pad wasn't thick enough to keep my butt-sky out of the water that collects. I got a 2 inch closed-cell foam pad and trimmed the edges to match the seat pan. I put the Gone Fishin' seat over it. It keeps me out of the water and higher in the kayak. Works great.

The Tarpon 130x looked like a good attempt to improve on the original Tarpon 100-160 series, but that's a tough act to follow. They failed.

TexasJim

[Ron Mc]

just keep in mind as you raise your height in a narrow boat, you lose primary stability.
It was amazing now much difference losing 3/4" from a seat to a Padz plus back band made in my Kestrel.
Guess I made a few changes along with that, as well, moving my ice mule to the front hatch for ballast.