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Already stocking for first BTB trip this summer, what should I return?

PostPosted:Sun Feb 09, 2020 4:07 pm
by niswanger
Hi folks,

Got the itch to go BTB this summer for Kings, Smacks, or anything sport fish big. I picked up some trolling stick baits and some plug spoons (not sure what you really call them). Have a gander of this attached picture, let me know if I should return any of it and/or which ones are best.

Top is a Rapala SXR-14 suspending 4-8" running depth 5.5" black/silver
Under it is another one in ghost white
Then under it, 3rd one down is XSR-12 4.75" 4-8' running depth suspending in Pilchard color
Then at the bottom is a yo-zuri crystal 3d floating 5.25" 14' max running depth in Sardine color
To the right pictured vertically is the same yo-zuri in chartreuse silver
Finally to the far left a pack of Got-Cha 7.80z jigging plugs for around the rigs I suppose?

Image

Thank you,
Roy

Re: Already stocking for first BTB trip this summer, what should I return?

PostPosted:Sun Feb 09, 2020 8:05 pm
by Ron Mc
You often can't get to the speed in a kayak to troll floating-diving lures deep enough - many want 6+ kts.
You might want to look up the lures on TackleDirect, because they usually list optimum trolling speeds and depths.
Amazon and Roy's both sell Halco max 110, which is a sinking lipless trolling lure that will get you deeper paddling a kayak to troll.
Those Yo-Zuri or Cha-Cha jigs will get way down, though.
Good-ole Mirrorlure 52M is comparatively inexpensive and will get down there (and they offer PurpleDemon).
You might also want a surface lure like a Halco C-Gar to cast to surface action you may paddle into.

Image notice a Halco Max stripey on Glenn's videos with major mackerel tooth scars

Image Red is always a good color for fish looking up, and purple is a good deep-water color.
If you visit TackleDirect, they have a current stock of Major Craft jigs in 1.76 oz - they don't always have these Japan lures in stock.

Re: Already stocking for first BTB trip this summer, what should I return?

PostPosted:Mon Feb 10, 2020 10:57 am
by niswanger
Thank you Ron. This was a rush/impulse buy from the clearance end cap at Field and Stream. These stick baits were on clearance down to about $9 from ~$15; however, the real driving force was the buy 5 get 5 free so essentially these were only about $4.50 each. So I'm going back to return the suspending small bill shallow divers and buying all of the yo-zuri deep divers. They also have those cha-cha jigs with a tensile skirt.

On top of this my receipt has a survey for $10 off $50 and as this lot of 10 lures was just over $50 it will make my second round even better.

I do plan on finding a couple of Halco max 110's but will also make a few leader rigs with two trebles, j-hook and skirt to troll ribbon fish as well.

Thank you,
Roy

Re: Already stocking for first BTB trip this summer, what should I return?

PostPosted:Mon Feb 10, 2020 12:26 pm
by impulse
One thing I found handy when fishing off the beach in my kayak was to turn down the barbs to make the hooks easier to remove. With 2 hands and a stable platform, pulling the hooks with a pair of pliers is pretty easy, even on a good sized fish.

With one free hand and no stable deck, barbless hooks are a lot easier to pull without losing my balance. Especially on bigger fish- and even more so on the occasional shark and the dreaded gafftops.

Re: Already stocking for first BTB trip this summer, what should I return?

PostPosted:Mon Feb 10, 2020 3:02 pm
by SWFinatic
niswanger wrote:I do plan on finding a couple of Halco max 110's but will also make a few leader rigs with two trebles, j-hook and skirt to troll ribbon fish as well.

Thank you,
Roy


Some 1-2 oz jigs will come in handy. Good to have those Gotcha plugs for Spanish. And yeah the Halco 110's are money well spent. Also good to have ribbon rigs with different weights depending on how deep the kings are. I keep all my jigs and lures in individual sandwich baggies with a wire leader/swivel tied on. I have these baggies stored in a leader or worm bag. The individual baggies keep the hooks from other lures/rigs getting tangled and I can write on the baggies the size of jig, weight, size of leader wire, etc.

Re: Already stocking for first BTB trip this summer, what should I return?

PostPosted:Mon Feb 10, 2020 8:48 pm
by Killerbee
Lools like a great assortment. Hooks need to be bigger saltwater hooks on anything your pulling. Ask me how I know lol. I would get some glass minnow jigs as well! Smacks and bait cant resist them. As well as everything else lol

Re: Already stocking for first BTB trip this summer, what should I return?

PostPosted:Tue Feb 11, 2020 9:37 am
by niswanger
I appreciate the feedback. I did a return of the suspending small bill Rapala XR-14's and bought the rest of the Yo-Zuri deep divers, they only have about 6 of them. I think I got a really good deal here. If you have a Field and Stream close by then you may find the same thing. They have one full isle full of clearance items (about 30% off) but what really caught my attention was the buy 5 clearance items and get 5 free, so if you play your 5 and 5 purchases right you get a real bang for your buck. All sales like this will charge you for the most expensive and give the lowest cost for free so I got my 10 items per lot purchase of close to equal vale. Below is a sample lot of 20 pieces I got for $68 out the door...quick calculation puts this at a typical retail value of $222.

Image

Now to buy a few Halco 110/130's, some king wire, hooks, swivels, and dusters.

-Roy

Re: Already stocking for first BTB trip this summer, what should I return?

PostPosted:Tue Feb 11, 2020 5:24 pm
by Mulligan
If you want your investments to last more than one trip, make sure to get some heavy duty 36" to 48" steel leaders. Those smacks and kings will cut right through any 50-60# mono leaders. I though no way those teeth will cut through 60# mono leaders. That was an expensive lesson.

I used to make my own steel leaders with the wire, duster, and etc. But I realized kings and smacks bite the trolling lures just off the leader. So I stopped wasting my time with that.

Good luck!

Re: Already stocking for first BTB trip this summer, what should I return?

PostPosted:Tue Feb 11, 2020 6:21 pm
by niswanger
Mulligan wrote:If you want your investments to last more than one trip, make sure to get some heavy duty 36" to 48" steel leaders. Those smacks and kings will cut right through any 50-60# mono leaders. I though no way those teeth will cut through 60# mono leaders. That was an expensive lesson.

I used to make my own steel leaders with the wire, duster, and etc. But I realized kings and smacks bite the trolling lures just off the leader. So I stopped wasting my time with that.

Good luck!


Oh yeah, this isn't the be-all-end-all lot for Kings, Smacs, and Cobia for sure. I returned the #2 4x strong Mustad trebles in exchange for the #4 (more appropriate size). So now I just need to determine if I want to go the Professor Salt method using 44lb/61lb single strand malin wire with hay bail twists OR use the 7-strand stuff with the shank wrap method. Just haven't found the pros/cons between 7-strand vs single malin wire.

I bought all those Yo-Zuris because at a final cost of only $4 I just couldn't pass it up. The other few stick baits are for my bass pre-spawn arsenal.

I'm getting really pumped for this BTB thing, but I'm also optimistically cautious as well. Still need to buy two marine VHF radios for safety etc. Also, need to learn the best way to plow through the surf, with or w/o the mirage drives? With or w/o the side kick AMAs on the 13' Revo, etc. etc.

Thank you,
Roy

Re: Already stocking for first BTB trip this summer, what should I return?

PostPosted:Wed Feb 12, 2020 10:51 am
by SWFinatic
7 strand vs single is kinda like Ford, Chevy, etc. The 7 strand is stronger but once one of the strands get nicked it's much weaker than single. This is something you can refine once you get some trips under your belt.

As far as surf launching/landing pay attention to where the tide is when you launch. If the tide is low you're likely going to have to paddle. If the tide is up you should (I caution should) be able to peddle. Peddling gives you more power to plow through the waves than paddling especially in a heavier kayak like the PA but you run the risk of hitting a bar and bending a shaft or doing other damage to the drive. Coming back in backwards is best in the PA. Watch the video below. If you do it just like the guy in the video you won't flip. https://youtu.be/6zNM2ANJyTw

In the Revo you should be able to launch without peddles fine. Just paddle through until you get past the breakers then peddle. I wouldn't run the AMA's through the breakers (both going out and coming back) unless they're only 1 footers. Put them on once you get past the last bar. On the landing in the revo unless you've practiced I would come in backwards also. It takes a little longer but your chances of flipping on a lot less.

Leash everything including your radio. Yeah your radio will float but if you're in big swells and it goes in the water it can get away from you in a hurry and that's when you need it most.

Re: Already stocking for first BTB trip this summer, what should I return?

PostPosted:Wed Mar 04, 2020 3:47 pm
by Longliner
That's funny, I've never stopped stocking up on supplies

Re: Already stocking for first BTB trip this summer, what should I return?

PostPosted:Wed Mar 04, 2020 7:55 pm
by SteveRetrieve
Image

Not sure if anyone uses these but this discount popped up in my email


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Re: Already stocking for first BTB trip this summer, what should I return?

PostPosted:Wed Mar 04, 2020 10:26 pm
by Ron Mc
TackleDirect is a great vendor, and both your purchases and reviews add up to store credit.

That particular lure, 200mm, is a bit large for trolling behind your kayak.

Re: Already stocking for first BTB trip this summer, what should I return?

PostPosted:Thu Mar 05, 2020 12:31 am
by Prof. Salt
I can tell you the Halco max 110 in baitfish pattern catches good fish even when I stop paddling to fight a fish on another rod and it suspends below the kayak. As long as it isn't dragging bottom it will get bit some of the time. Three of my four best snappers were accidental catches that way last season. Snapper 26-29" are always welcome!

Re: Already stocking for first BTB trip this summer, what should I return?

PostPosted:Thu Mar 05, 2020 10:41 am
by kickingback
I second Glenn's post! I bring a couple of "jigging" lures and 2 Halco's in case one breaks off and the wire DIY rigs for ribbon fish are all I need and take on my trips. Of course some regular hooks and weights to catch snapper and other bottom feeders around the rigs.

Re: Already stocking for first BTB trip this summer, what should I return?

PostPosted:Sun Mar 08, 2020 12:39 am
by Kalait
I am planning on using a 30-pound braid for my main-line, and fluorocarbon leader. What should my leader line weight be 80 or 100?

Re: Already stocking for first BTB trip this summer, what should I return?

PostPosted:Sun Mar 08, 2020 7:26 am
by Ron Mc
not much difference in 80- and 100-lb fluoro. The idea behind the thickness is abrasion tolerance to toothy fish.
Halco also makes really nice and low-profile wire bite traces. No one sells them here, but the ebay vendor in Croatia is reliable.
I know Glenn doesn't use them, and has cited visual acuity of macks, but I've even used the 20-lb inshore on big specs.
In the case of all fish, their feeding instinct is stronger than their IQ.

Re: Already stocking for first BTB trip this summer, what should I return?

PostPosted:Sun Mar 08, 2020 8:39 am
by SWFinatic
Kalait wrote:I am planning on using a 30-pound braid for my main-line, and fluorocarbon leader. What should my leader line weight be 80 or 100?


No reason to go that heavy with the leader. If you're running 30 lb main line 50 lb leader is plenty.

Re: Already stocking for first BTB trip this summer, what should I return?

PostPosted:Mon Apr 06, 2020 3:10 pm
by niswanger
For those using the Halco Max 110, what type/size/length leader are you using? Using the SPRO #8 swivel?

Thank you,
Roy

Re: Already stocking for first BTB trip this summer, what should I return?

PostPosted:Thu Apr 09, 2020 5:54 pm
by Squidward
I am still using the single strand steel leader usually the #5 which I think is rated at 44lbs. I know a lot of people have switched to titanium but I’m too cheap. I usually make my leaders about 24” to 30” long.

Re: Already stocking for first BTB trip this summer, what should I return?

PostPosted:Thu Apr 09, 2020 7:11 pm
by niswanger
Squidward wrote:I am still using the single strand steel leader usually the #5 which I think is rated at 44lbs. I know a lot of people have switched to titanium but I’m too cheap. I usually make my leaders about 24” to 30” long.


Thank you sir, I have some that I'm also making stinger rigs for kmacs.

-Roy